We’ve always wanted to interview Israel and Maria Folau – to hear their side of the story, to find out how they coped through a tumultuous period, and what effect it had on their faith, and on their marriage & family. It’s never been fully told. In July of 2025, Family First CEO Bob McCoskrie sat down with both of them at their home in Brisbane. An exclusive interview with Family First New Zealand to be shared at the annual Forum on the Family. For the very first time, you get to hear their side of the story.
Script of full interview:
BOB: We’ve always wanted to interview Israel and Maria Folau. To hear their side of the story. To find out how they coped through a tumultuous period and what effect it had on their faith, and on their marriage and family. It’s never been fully told, so in July we travelled to Australia and sat down with both of them at their home in Brisbane. An exclusive interview with Family First New Zealand. For the very first time, you get to hear their side of the story.
Israel and Maria, we really appreciate you making yourself available for the Forum on the Family. I’ve been trying to get this interview for probably about four years. You’ve agreed now to do the interview and I guess my first question is, why now? What’s changed? What’s given you the freedom to speak up, do you think?
IZZY: It’s always been on our heart to, to want to talk about, um, that whole situation and, and what we’ve gone through and, and what we stand for, which is what’s most important for us. But also the right platform, uh, in order to share, uh, our experiences and, and what’s so important to us.
BOB: Maria?
MARIA: Yeah, like for us, like for me, it was more of a trust thing.
We’ve been approached by, um, What would you say?
BOB: Mainstream media.
MARIA: Yeah, mainstream media. Um, but we, none of them guaranteed us full editorial rights, so that was just a no -brainer for us. Uh, we support you and what you do, um, and what you guys all stand for. And we thought, yeah, it’s been like six years now since it all happened.
And when you approached us, we, yeah. We jumped at the opportunity, really.
BOB: Look, you said six years. I, um, when I travel around New Zealand, I tell people it was actually eight years ago it started. It was in 2017, during the same -sex marriage debate in Australia. We’d had it in New Zealand. [00:02:00] You were having your plebiscite, or your referendum as we call it.
And, Izzy, you posted a lovely tweet that just said you love and respect all people, but you will not support gay marriage. That really was the time when you became public enemy number one, wasn’t it?
IZZY: Yeah, that’s right. That was, uh, I think a lot of people tend to forget that that was probably the start of that whole situation with, um, Rugby Australia.
Yeah, and, uh, yeah, it was actually a… I was voicing my opinion and it was from my heart. Um, and, uh, at that time, you know, being a Christian, and I thought it was so important to voice that and having a public platform to really, you know, stamp my, um, where I stand. Um, and it’s still the same now. We still have that love for people.
Um, and that, that was my heart. I just didn’t agree with the way that, um, you know, these sporting organizations were heading in Australia was they had the yes vote campaign and it was something that was… Yes for
BOB: gay marriage. Yeah, yeah.
IZZY: [00:03:00] So, and that was something that was happening within the, um, you know, within the sporting, um, environments.
And I… You know, being a Christian, I just, I didn’t want to stand for that.
BOB: Did you feel like the blowback happened then as much?
IZZY: When I sent that tweet out, there was a lot of backlash. Probably more so than what I had expected. And it was just the start of things and it, you know, it hung around for a little bit and then it sort of blew over.
But, yeah, I did get a few warnings from Rugby Australia, you know, like, to toe the line on what to say on certain things as people know. I just didn’t want to be restricted or controlled around those things, especially when it comes to my beliefs around the Bible and standing up for that.
BOB: Maria, did you see the red flags then? Because I mean, there was a story in the New Zealand papers saying, you know, Maria Tutaia and Israel Folau share pictures from their controversial wedding. It was controversial because [00:04:00] it was a man and a woman apparently.
MARIA: Yeah, very, very controversial.
BOB: So did you see what was coming?
MARIA: We committed a crime.
BOB: Because there was another article by the Daily Mail. They said here, From a fairytale wedding and glittering netball career to being viciously attacked by trolls, how the controversial wife of Israel Folau risks losing it all as she stands by her husband.
MARIA: Oh gosh, jeez, far out, that sounds a bit hairy hearted, doesn’t it?
BOB: Oh, it’s dramatic. That’s the media were all over it.
MARIA: Absolutely.
IZZY: So when I sent that tweet out, the, I remember it was a date.
MARIA: It was in Canberra. I remember, oh, actually, yeah, that’s right.
BOB: For the Silver Ferns.
IZZY:. The Wallabies were playing Argentina the next day in Canberra, so you were actually there.
MARIA: That’s right. I flew and I was thinking, mate, do I need to carry a knife in my bag? Because we, hey, I was getting just the death threats of doom from everyone, um, left, right and centre. And I remember jumping on the plane and, you know, you walk in. It was a three by [00:05:00] three seater, so it was a small plane and I was flying from Sydney? So it was a domestic flight and every, as soon as I walked in past the air hostesses, it was like zoom because, um, everyone, well I presume everyone knew who I was, um, that I was his wife. And you know when the
BOB: screens come down,
MARIA: Izzy’s face was all over it, you know, and I’m sitting there and the volume just going lower and lower because they were showing the news.
And because, um, you headline the news, like. every 24 -7, um, for, for that whole year, 29, or 27. 2017, yeah. So
BOB: So this is 2017?
MARIA: 2017 yeah.
BOB: This is before the, the hell meme?
MARIA: Yes. Yeah yeah it was. For me, cause I was still really new in the faith then. I just got baptised early in 2017. So I was still, um, I, I was always going to support Izzy regardless and I would always [00:06:00] tell him whether he was right or wrong, but that was something I was still learning. I thought that that was the end. Of everything. I didn’t think it was going to get any worse than that.
BOB: Because it was interesting watching the New Zealand media because in some ways they loved you as a silver fern. You know, you were scoring the goals, winning the world cups for the silver ferns and yet at the same time you’re associated with this Israel Folau and you actually saw the struggle that the media were having with that. And, of course, then comes out the infamous hell meme.
IZZY: Yeah.
BOB: And, you know, uh, drunks, homosexuals, adulterers, liars, fornicators, thieves, atheists, idolaters, they need to repent. I really just wanted to ask you, we know who was upset by this, but were you contacted by any drunks, adulterers, liars, fornicators, thieves, atheists and idolaters?
IZZY: No, I didn’t hear from anyone that had that, you know, that problem or struggled with it.
BOB: So just tell us about why you posted this, you know, where did you get it, what made you do it, and did you have any inkling of the [00:07:00] firestorm that was going to result from posting this?
IZZY: I had no idea. I had no idea that, um, as I was about to post this post, that I was going to get my contract terminated, that was the truth. But I just felt really convicted. in my heart to really share that. And it is confronting when you see that. And it’s like, wow, that’s not a really feel -good message or doesn’t give you any, you know, a warm feeling, but the truth, it’s the truth. You know, and I just wanted to, that was my heart around that. But I always share this a couple of months before I actually posted that. I was praying and asking God to really put me in a position to test my faith. And, uh, I, I always, I always said…
BOB: Dangerous prayer.
IZZY: Yeah, it’s a dangerous prayer. And I, and I told everyone…
MARIA: Can you ask me next time? Yeah.
IZZY: I always say to people just, you know, be careful what you ask for. It’s, um, but I, yeah, I really genuinely, [00:08:00] um, meant that. And when I prayed that prayer…
BOB: How did you think God would answer it when you asked, you know, you wanted to be bold with your faith? How did you think He was asking you to be bold?
IZZY: Oh, I didn’t, I didn’t, I didn’t think much of it. I didn’t, I didn’t… It didn’t, my mind didn’t come to a situation like this. I never thought that I’d be put in a position where my career would be on the line. It just never crossed my mind so.
BOB: But also the vilification. I mean, it’s not only the career, it was the vilification as well. I mean, as part of it, you also added basic gospel messages. You know, those that are living in sin will end up in hell unless you repent. Jesus Christ loves you. It’s the message that is preached from most Biblical church pulpits. Absolutely. These days. Yep. But they only focused on the one word, well two words, hell and homosexuality, didn’t they?
Yeah, that’s right. Maria, did you, I mean, did you know that meme was going to be posted and what was your response?
MARIA: No idea. I had no idea. Had absolutely no idea. I, we were at the gym. We were at Sydney Uni, working out. All of [00:09:00] a sudden his phone, your phone was going off by, um, yeah, colleagues. And they were just calling a lot.
BOB: To support or to, uh,
MARIA: No, to take the post down. So, um, Izzy, you spoke to your manager and you told him, No, I’m not going to take the post down. And I remember because we were in the car, so it was in Bluetooth and you could hear everything, and his manager was saying, they’re going to terminate you. And you said, then so be it. But I… I’ve told them I wasn’t going to compromise. I made it clear to Raylene and to the board that, um, yeah, I’m an employee of the Wallabies, but… You also re -signed too and told them that if you, you know, if you want to re -sign me, I’m, I’m just not going to compromise. It’s just how it is. And so they re -signed you. And so that was your messaging to your manager was that I already told them that I was going to compromise. So if they want to terminate me, then terminate. [00:10:00] We know where, what happened after that, so obviously going to court and that stuff, so, um,
BOB: What were you thinking, Maria? We really don’t need this.
MARIA: Oh, I was like, what the heck is going on? I’m like, what is this post? I jump online, I look at it, and I’m like, oh yeah, like, what’s wrong with that? Like, that’s a biblical message. And Izzy’s heart is always for, like we know, um, I’m following God. It’s not just about our own walk. It’s about others serving others as well. And so when I saw it, I didn’t, um, yeah, it was a powerful message, but also I can understand why people got immensely offended. And at that time, um, no one was coming out and saying anything about same sex marriage, um, and stuff. So you were, you were the first one. Um, so it was, yeah, for me, I was like, Oh my gosh. Buckle up, we are, we are in for a ride [00:11:00] and, um…
BOB: So Israel, what do you say to people who would say, look, it, it may be, uh, biblical, but it’s too confrontational, it’s not loving.
IZZY: What’s your response to that? Well, I would say that’s untrue. I think the most loving thing that a Christian can share is exactly that. Um, is the message of the Gospel and what the Gospel is all about. Um, sometimes it’s, it’s really confronting and the truth is, um, but what I didn’t want to do is affirm people that …the lifestyle that they were living in, or you know if they had troubles or challenges with those with those things… …is that affirming that that’s okay to stay in there that would be the most unloving thing to do.
The reason why I’m really passionate about Jesus, is because I used to live a lifestyle that was exactly that. And so when I share this message I tell people that, I struggle with those things, I actually you know was a… Big, um, big [00:12:00] on alcohol, um, drugs, all these sorts of things that I understood when I was doing it week in, week out.
It didn’t give me the satisfaction that you think it would, you know. And it wasn’t until I encountered Jesus that He gave me purpose and fulfilment that was, uh, or peace that this world can’t give you as the, as the Word says, I’ve lived this lifestyle, but Jesus has saved me from that. And he can do the same thing for you.
We’ve got to be, um, honest and upfront with, uh, confronting the, the, the lifestyle of sin that we’re in, you know, in order for us to be saved from it. you’ve got all these pressures from society and culture and that. But it’s so important to for a Christian to stand strong and be bold and not be ashamed of who you represent.
BOB: I mean the interesting thing is that probably every Sunday there’s pastors, ministers, church leaders who are preaching that exact Gospel and it’s not offensive. There’s not a media blowback and there’s not contracts being lost. But you did because it was in the public sphere. I’m interested [00:13:00] to know was there support coming out because a lot of your colleagues sports colleagues they would have the faith. Did you feel the support or did you really feel like everyone ran for cover.
IZZY: I felt there was verbal support, um, but I don’t know that it was genuine or not at the time because I guess when everything all broke out. There was so much happening around us and we were so consumed with the media storm just everything was just, you know, It was all about what was happening with us.
And so I knew within the team there was support from teammates and that. Um, and, and during that time, I think, uh, you know, having the lawyers that we did at the time, uh, they asked us if, if we would, um, see if the boys would support us, you know, because rugby Australia can’t sack, let’s say eight or nine of us, you know, like, so, and, and that was hard for me because I didn’t want to ask on, on my behalf, because to me.[00:14:00]
Standing up for Christ or your faith in Him is a personal thing and for me to ask them, I felt like I was almost putting them in a position to say yes and I didn’t want to do that. So in the end I just, I understood that there was contracts and livelihoods in the line, but it was only, it was their personal conviction that was going to tell them to say yes, you know.
In the end, you know, I made that, we had a conversation about it.
MARIA: So I asked. I asked, I asked, um, one of the senior players in the Wallabies. It was a difficult conversation for me to have as well, because again, exactly what Izzy was saying, there’s livelihoods on the line. At that time when I asked and nothing happened, I was so annoyed.
I was so, so annoyed. My heart was so darkened because I was like…
BOB: So they say they have the faith but they aren’t willing to really step up.
MARIA: [00:15:00] Well yeah, but then also, Izzy being Izzy, this is, you know, there’s always like… Opposites do attract because he’s just so loving and, and always sees the bright side of everything. I, um.
BOB: You wanted to patch things up.
MARIA: Oh man, no, I just was like, come on guys, like, you’re the, this is your mate. Like, but also you don’t have to come out and say you believe in the same thing, but you believe that Izzy has the right to believe in what he wants to believe in. But then, obviously nothing had happened and Izzy just reminded me that like, cause I was, I was saying to you, Oh, these guys are fake Christians.
Like don’t run on the field and do this and like have the cross on your thing. Like, and you, and you’re not even like, your mate, your mate is standing up for Jesus. Like come on guys. Again, Izzy reminded me, um, throughout everything that was happening was that everyone’s [00:16:00] faith is different. Their journey is different to ours.
I was just trying to rally up the boys to, you know, like,
BOB: have some backbone,
MARIA: have some backbone yeah, you know. And, but then as time has gone by, hey, we always talk about it. We were supposed to go through it alone. We, we, this was something that God ordained for Izzy and I to go through. I guess it would have been different had we had, um, support from the other Wallabies boys.
And it was hard to watch you, like, um, I know you wanted to be at the World Cup and I know you wanted to play for Australia and for the team but, um, When they were playing Wales, eh, I think it was the quarterfinal. Yeah, quarterfinal, yeah. I was texting one of the wives and she was checking in to see, um, how Izzy was.
And I was watching the game. Um, Izzy was in the room and he was reading his Bible. [00:17:00] And you had the biggest smile on your face. And I said to you, like, the boys are playing, do you want to come watch? And he’s like, God, no, no, no, I just want to spend some time with God. And I text that to her and, yeah, she was just blown away by, um, you know, you could have gone the other way. He could have gone and drunk. You could have gone and cursed all the boys or like, but you were so supportive of them. You prayed and read the Bible and you were just so, um, you know, this is the path and the journey that God has put us in.
You prayed that prayer, which next time can you let me know? just to give me a heads up?
BOB: In the quiet, was there a time when you just wanted to say to Izzy, just pull it down, pull it down, let the thing go away.
MARIA: Absolutely. Oh, yeah.
BOB: so why didn’t you?
MARIA: I’m not going to sit here and say, Oh, I’m a devout Christian wife. I was no, no, no, I was.
So every Mondays we had to fly to Melbourne. We’re on the red eye flight 6 AM to meet [00:18:00] our lawyers and. We were obviously in the media all the time and every flight, every airport travel was just, it just felt like everyone was on us. Holding hands, we just had our head down and just went straight to the gate, sit there.
People that we’re sitting next to, in front of us, behind us, you could just tell, like, they just wanted a, either glass us in the face or something. It was just one of those things where I was just so tired. I was playing as well. I was playing for the Adelaide Thunderbirds. So I had to perform on the court.
Um, I had, you know, people in Netball, Australia who, I think, I think she was, I’m not sure whether she was in Netball Australia, but I think she was a commentator at the time. Um, just, I guess, wanted to get me out of the competition because I was supporting my husband. Which is really bizarre hey who supports their husband. So yeah it was just all that pressure. Like I knew every missed shot would be it’s cause you can’t handle, yeah we’re getting on here. Every time we’d run out on the court I was booed. I had to like, after the games boost it to the car just in case you know someone would do something to me. I just got really tired of that.
I got sick of living in my apartment, not being able to go outside for some fresh air, because we knew paparazzi were outside. Um, and I told him, like… Ok, I’m done. Can you just, can you just take it down? Be rid of this whole legal situation. Let’s apologise and get on with our life.
BOB: And what did your loving husband say?
MARIA: Hell no. What are you nuts? No way. And I knew
BOB: What was your response to that?
MARIA: Divorce, no. We had the papers to speed dial my lawyer, no. Um, like I knew, it was probably one of the stupidest things I’ve ever said, to be [00:20:00] honest. Cause, um.
IZZY: It just shows the, like how hard it was, how challenging it was. And I, out of the whole thing.
That was the hardest thing for me was, was um seeing Maria go through that, and then also, you know, for her being my, my wife, and then having to play at the same time, it was a lot of pressure to handle. I didn’t care about the media storm, didn’t bother me. You know, people were looking at me, staring at me, saying stuff to me when we go out in public.
That was hard, but it wasn’t as hard as watching your wife closely and, and how she really felt on the inside, and, and just the challenges that she had to face. I just, at the time, I wish I could just take all that weight off her and carried it for her. But the fruit that we had received out of the whole situation, what God, um, had taught us and, and, and built inside of us and our character is something that we would have never gotten from not going through it.
BOB: You see, from my angle, it looked like, and [00:21:00] to our shame, I think that a lot of Christians and a lot of Christian leaders ran for cover. They saw the response, they saw the media pile on, and I think, in fairness, we deserted you. Did you feel like that?
IZZY: I certainly felt like that. Um, within Australia, I certainly felt as if the church, just sat back and just let things go and watch things unfold.
And I felt as if there was not much support at all. Um, which should be the opposite actually, because we as a church should be that light that is to, you know, go out and stand for Christ and have an impact within the world. But at the time I just felt that they were more so worried about, um, You know, the backlash or what things that might come back against him, then, then standing for the truth and that, that, that to me [00:22:00] was sad.
When I look back at the events when it unfolded, it’s really sad that I felt that that’s how the church reacted. You know, now as time’s gone on It’s a little bit different now.
BOB: Well, yeah, I think you’ve given them some backbone and boldness.
MARIA: Sorry, I was just going to say, like, a lot of Christians were saying to us, like, what you had questioned before was, um,
BOB: Be more loving in your message.
MARIA: Yeah, you need to be more loving.
BOB: Well, it’s what Railing Castle told you, wasn’t it? You can quote the Bible, but only the nice bits.
IZZY: Yeah, that’s right. And I said, well, I accept the full Bible, not just the nice parts of the Bible. I cannot just quote the nice parts that make people feel warm and fuzzy.
When I read the Bible, it convicts myself of certain things that maybe I need repentance of. And that’s what it’s there for, you know. For me to, to, to say the full truth I need to share things that I believe that God has put on my heart to share. And I’m not in control [00:23:00] of people’s reactions or emotions.
But as long as God sees the position of our hearts, that’s the most important. I believe that God will do the rest.
BOB: So it seems like the actual tactic is not necessarily it’s about Israel. It’s about saying that anybody who quotes biblical truths. We will come after you and we will make, we will send a chilling effect so nobody else wants to follow down your track.
Does that sort of make sense? Did it feel like that? That they were using you to basically say to all the Christendom, Don’t quote the Bible, we don’t want to hear it.
IZZY: Yeah, absolutely. I felt that. I think, especially after that, talking to people, um, My teammates or people within the public, they, they, a lot of them agree with us.
They just were too scared to voice it because of they saw what happened to us, you know, and that was, I believe part of the tactic that the enemy uses, which is, you know, same sex marriage to, to try and scare the church into [00:24:00] not voicing what the truth is, or, you know, um, if you do that. You’re going to get the same treatment as Israel and Maria, you know, and that’s what it is.
But I think for the church is it’s so even more so important to stand up, but not, not be divided, you know, to stand up in unity as a church and just like go on the truth.
BOB: At the height of the, of the storm, I think I saw you mention that you, some of the social media, I mean, these are from people who are preaching diversity, equity, and inclusion, and yet What they were saying about you, what they were saying about Izzy, was just vile, it was, uh, aggressive, it was, it was threatening.
Um, that, that must have been, oh, that must have really dug deep. I mean, is that what you say when you talk about the knives in the back all the time?
MARIA: Oh yeah, oh my gosh, yeah, for sure, like, um, jeez, we…
BOB: They’re preaching diversity and inclusion and yet they’re not…
MARIA: Absolutely. It [00:25:00] was just, it was just hard.
Like, how do I even describe it? You know, we got an email with someone with a gun emoji and said some other stuff like, we’re going to kill you and all this, you know. Death threats. We hope your children go to hell. We hope they burn. We didn’t have children at that time, but we still get it now anyway. But I think cause I’m just so used to it now.
It’s, but back then it was, yeah, it was, it was, it was rough. It was, it was full on. Like I had no choice but to go to God. Like I, I was at that point where, um, you know, I was still new in the faith and I, you know, Like, Izzy was just such a great example for me to, um, to, to believe, but also action as well, because, I mean, he could have gone the other way.
And I say that because I know everyone else would have gone the other way, you know, in terms of like alcohol, you could have, um, not text your friends that [00:26:00] were texting you, not that there was many that text you at the time anyway. But I, I just. I just see that the model of like love and compassion and forgiveness.
Um, and that was his messaging to me the whole time. And so for me, even though I was like going down the dark path, just watching him every day just really brought light in my heart and in my mind. And that Jesus. Wow, this guy really does believe in God. I’m going to give it a go. I have nothing else to go to.
And I’m so thankful that I did because it, it’s brought me to this.
BOB: Yeah. But then something amazing happened because you, you did a fundraiser for legal fees. And I mean, that, that response, I mean, how did that feel? You know,
MARIA: yeah we were crying
BOB: millions raised, people just from all around the world wanting to contribute.
IZZY: Yeah, what you call those silent supporters, you know, like, and we, we [00:27:00] knew that through the donations of, um, towards the legal case.
And I think the outrage from the public or the community or the silent supporters, you saw that through when they took the GoFundMe down. And then ACL stepped in and they, they took over and the people’s voices were heard through their giving, you know, and so we, we knew that when we run into people in the, in the streets, they would come up to us and, you know, we support you, we’re, you know, we’re right behind you.
Um, and so we knew that we weren’t alone, but, um, but in
BOB: so you were getting both, you were getting both the vilification and, uh, Support?
IZZY: Yeah, well getting
MARIA: At that, yeah, at that time, but yeah, I guess at that time it felt more vilification. But as time went on, like, like we’re six years down the track now.
Now we, even believers and non -believers who always stop us wherever we go. And, and, uh… More so, one, the believers who believe, and then the unbelievers who are just tired of, [00:28:00] um, being told what to do or what to believe, um, or what their children should be learning at school, and, um. Just
IZZY: all the woke stuff.
MARIA: All the woke stuff.
BOB: If you were in front of Raelene Castle now, what would you say to her?
IZZY: Um, When I go back in time, I think we could have probably, um, done things a little bit differently. Maybe sat down and had a bit more time to, um, really discuss, uh, both our views. My views and her views from an organisational point of view.
Um, Like I said, I’ve always, I’ve made it public that I don’t have no animosity towards her and the decision that she had to make. I could easily sit down with her right now and have a conversation with her.
BOB: Maria, you’re not quite as complimentary, are you?
MARIA: Oh, mate, I’ve had so many, like, um, yeah, conflicting…views about, you know, that if I were
BOB: The whole contract process.
MARIA: Yeah, oh, just the whole contract [00:29:00] process. Like, even just Rugby Australia sending the wrong contract, you know, that didn’t have the special social media clause. And that was such a, a key point, um, you know, in that whole ordeal was that, These were the type of people we were dealing with, with Rugby Australia, was that, one, you told Raylene multiple times that you weren’t going to compromise.
Two, they sent the wrong contract, which you, you signed the first contract. And then they rung again saying, Hey, I’m sorry, we sent you the wrong contract, we missed the social media clause, can you, we’re going to send it to you, can you sign? And you said no, that’s the contract you’ve sent me and that’s the contract I’ve signed, so I’m not re -signing. There was supposed to be some
IZZY: special clause. conditions, as you say, but there was nothing. I had a standard contract, same as everyone else.
BOB: That’s the part of the story that you think never got told fairly.
IZZY: Yeah, absolutely, because people just thought that, you know, they took things out of context. I was coming off a contract.
People quote that, um, I [00:30:00] said that, like, if you don’t agree with, um, what I’m saying then I’m happy to walk away, but that was on the basis that… I was off contract and I was about to re -sign, so Raylene then decided to give me a new contract and didn’t put any special conditions within that contract, in terms of the social media.
So, that wasn’t really reported, um, it was just people just, you know, the media, mainstream media were reporting, oh, you know, he’s breached the contract and X, Y and Z, but that wasn’t true, so.
BOB: Anything in the process that you wish you’d done slightly different?
MARIA: I don’t have any
IZZY: I don’t have any regrets, I did mention earlier that things could have been different. It’s not a regret, I just, I just wish we had, I had more time, um, to really slow down with Rugby Australia and talk things through. It was a firestorm, wasn’t it? Yeah, it just, the media.
MARIA: It went so quick, like, yeah, we had to make decisions on the spot.[00:31:00]
BOB: The media were throwing petrol on the whole thing.
MARIA: : Oh yeah, for sure.
IZZY: Yeah, and I say that the media was the one that created, you know, made it bigger than what it actually was, you know, and put a lot of pressure on both Rugby Australia and everyone else, so. But yeah, I think if we did have a bit more time, it could have been a little bit different, but in saying that.
Um, yeah, I have no regrets at all.
BOB: See, and what I found interesting was that you didn’t back off. I noticed that you were still posting memes. Do you believe in the right of Australians to practice their religion without fear of discrimination in the workplace? You posted a meme of Galatians 1 .10. Are you seeking the approval of man or God?
You didn’t back off. So it seemed like that you were still standing strong on your faith.
IZZY: I would say for the Christians, it’s not a nice thing to go through, Just know that when you being said, negative things about you, It’s cause you’re in the truth, you know, that’s the most important thing.
MARIA: And to stand firm. Like, I love Jesus, I love, Um, I love the Bible. I love His [00:32:00] teaching.
BOB: Your not quite at the Daniel in the lions den.
MARIA: Like, Oh my gosh, honestly like, it’s you’re gonna be fine with Christ. You will be fine.
BOB: But that’s the thing Maria right. I think people do look at, Uh, what you did and, and it does give them backbone.
See, cause I’d suggest to you Israel that the Manly Seven, when they refused to wear the Pride shirt, they knew the blowback they were going to get and the death threats cause we’ve interviewed them for a previous conference. So they knew it was coming, but I think what you did was you gave them, you stiffened their spine because you were willing to be bold.
Does it feel like that, that you’ve, you’ve stiffened some people’s spines? Have you been told that?
IZZY: Yes, yeah, we’ve been told that a whole, a lot of times actually, and I believe a big reason why we had to go through what we had to go through is to encourage other believers, you know. It’s just part of the assignment that I believe God has had on us, you know.
And um, when we saw that play out, you know, those guys saw what happened to us. [00:33:00] You know, it’s something about uniting in, as, as in numbers. You know, that Manly was never going to sack seven of them. You know what I mean? I don’t want to take any credit because I know God’s just used us as examples or vessels for that.
And we’re here now and we get to talk about it and try and encourage other, other believers.
BOB: Has there been a tipping point, do you think, in our culture where in some ways you were the sacrificial lamb, but it’s turning and people are finding their voice again?
IZZY: Yeah, absolutely. I see that within sports, within Australia.
And, uh, there’s a couple of athletes that we follow in both rugby league and rugby union. And they’re proud Christians and they’re not ashamed to come out publicly and say, I love Jesus and they’re talking about it. They’re actually showing, you know, guys praying together. And it’s like becoming a lot more normal you know.
BOB: how’s the media reacting to that?
IZZY:
IZZY: Yeah well there’s no sorta push back to that, well what I’ve seen anyway. I think, I hate tryna push things back to us, but as you mentioned earlier, being the sacrificial lamb, I think it’s really given those guys encouragement to stand up and just be bold for Christ.
MARIA: And those guys have also text you as well to say thanks. Yeah. For doing, you know, what you did. Yeah. Um, yeah.
IZZY: Yeah, just the impact.
MARIA: Just the impact, really, yeah.
BOB: Maria, you said a really powerful thing, that you realised that God had called you to do this alone, the two of you.
MARIA: Mm.
BOB: When, when did you come to that point? Because that, that must have been quite a, both an empowering, but also a freeing, but also a bit of a scary thought, a realisation as well.
MARIA: Yeah. Well, I did. I did make a covenant with God when I said that I would marry, you know.
BOB: At your controversial wedding of a man and a woman.
MARIA: At my controversial wedding, oh gosh.
Anyways, I was again going through, going through all that stuff and I just had enough. And I was sitting in [00:35:00] the car and I was going to a cafe and on the street that I was, um, that I had parked on, there was no left or right turn. Um, anyways, I said in the car. Lord, I cannot do this. I’m done. Can you just be rid of this situation?
You were in Sydney at the time, eh?
IZZY: Yeah, I was.
MARIA: Uh, and then I got out of the car. I was walking to the cafe and I met this English guy and he stopped me and he said, um, you need to bask in God’s love. And I was like,
BOB: just like that
MARIA: just like that. And I asked him, I just, uh, you must know who my husband is.
Do you know who I am? And he was like, no. I said, Israel Folau? He goes, no, never heard of him. I said, where are you going? He said, I’m going to the hospital. The hospital was that way, the opposite way. Anyways, we. Um, I passed him, I turned around, like, within seconds and he was gone. And I truly do believe that God sends angels in human [00:36:00] form.
And he was there to remind me that, like, you’re gonna be okay. Like, I chose you to stand next to this man, um, and go through the storm and this fire, um, and you will do that and I’ll be with you all the way. You’ll be fine. And so… Your question, that was when I knew, like,
IZZY: That we had to go through.
MARIA: That we had to go through this together.
He had chosen me before I was born, that this was going to happen, and that you were going to marry Izzy, and this was, this was your, this was your life. Was to follow me, go through a bit of persecution here and there, but also, um, bask and enjoy, um, the fruits and the love of, of Jesus. Yeah.
BOB: I asked, um, on my social media, I asked, I said to people that I was going to be interviewing you for our conference.
And I said, what, what question would they like to ask you? Like some quick fire questions. One of the key ones was, would you do it again knowing [00:37:00] the blowback?
MARIA: Absolutely.
IZZY: Yeah, definitely. Yeah. We’ve got asked that question many a time before. And I would say yes, because of how close we got. We grew to the Lord during that time, in times of, um, you know, persecution.
As I said earlier, the fruit that we got out of that, I often think of James 1 verses 2 about counted all joy when you are faced with various trials or challenges, you know, because of what it produces within your faith, you know. And so, yeah, I’ll definitely do it all over again, definitely.
BOB: And is it still over?
Um, because I mean, uh, we made contact. Last year, because there was this article where you played at Twickenham Barbarians and apparently every time you scored a try the whole crowd booed. And I went and listened to the audio of the actual thing and found actually they were cheering and having a great time and there was a little vendor mob in the corner.
Does it feel like it’s, it’s over? Do you feel like you can just get on with your life or is [00:38:00] it, it’s always going to be there? I mean, it’s part of the reason you’re in Japan, playing in Japan today, uh, of the day of the conference. It was also the reason why they were considering for you to play against the Lions?
Weren’t they and recently. But there is still a cloud over you. Is that cloud ever going to go do you think? Does it matter?
MARIA: I think the cloud will go if we apologise. That was the main thing that was the issue with… with everything that was happening with we didn’t back down. It’s not about backing down but it’s about… Believing in what you believe, like, like, oh man, there’s so many encounters that we’ve had that Jesus has showed us that he is there. And even though, it’s funny when we see people for the first time in a long time, they’re like, oh, how have you guys been? Are you guys okay? We’re like looking at them like, mate, we’re so good.
Seriously, bro, we are as good at like, this is, this, I [00:39:00] love my life. Like, We are so blessed with our beautiful children, our family are healthy, we are just living the best life that we’re living.
BOB: There was one other question which was asked by someone on our social media to ask you, but I’ve seen it come up a lot of times, I’ve been asked it as well.
And it’s this, what would you do if your child came to you and said that they were gay?
IZZY: I would, well, me personally, and I believe you’d agree, we’d affirm obviously our love for them, because it’s obviously still our children, but we would, um, obviously state from a Biblical point of view that what they’re engaged in is actually a sin, you know, and we wouldn’t want you guys to go down the path of going down that.
So like any parent would if their child was troubled with drugs or alcohol, it’s the same thing, you know. So we would definitely, our love wouldn’t change for them. Uh, love would be the [00:40:00] same. From a biblical point of view, we would state the truth to them and try and help them through whatever their, you know, their struggle is.
MARIA: Like what Izzy said, I would reaffirm to my child that we would love them regardless, and not even just our children, everyone whom we encounter. Um, uh, but I also do believe in, yeah, the power of prayer. And I’m not saying like conversion therapy or whatever.
BOB: You can’t ban conversion, can you?
MARIA: Yeah, exactly. But, um, I, I believe. Yeah, I believe in prayer. I believe in, um, fellowship. I believe in teaching your, your children and, and showing the light as well at the same time that, yeah, if my child was gay, I would love them. I would call out the sin. Um, and I would just pray.
BOB: Okay, I need you to really ram down some backbone into everybody that’s watching right now.
That is, what advice would you give someone? Who thinks they need to speak up publicly for [00:41:00] the faith. But they know that there’s going to be consequences and they, you know, could be tough consequences.
IZZY: I’m really inspired by the story in the Bible about Daniel in Babylon and it says that he purposed in his heart, meaning he made a decision already in his heart, that he wasn’t going to defile his body and partake in the king’s food and wine.
And so what I would say to Christians out there is, Before that fire comes, just know it’s going to come, like one way or another it’s going to come. Just make a decision already within your heart. Because if it comes, you can’t just… Turn up and say, Oh, yeah, I’m going to stand for God. You have to make a decision early before it actually comes to you.
But I would say for the Christian, you can never go wrong by standing, standing up and doing what’s right. Even in the midst of the fire.
MARIA: I guess for me, the only thing that I would question is how strong is your faith? Do [00:42:00] you truly believe in the Word? And the fullness of it. Not just the nice warm fuzzy bits that Jesus is love and everything.
It’s the parts where it really condemns you, conflicts you. In your conscience you’re like questioning, Oh gosh, is this, do I want to follow this?
MARIA: Do I want to live this life that is set apart from everyone else? That’s the cost that you pay for walking with God. And like Izzy said, when a situation does arise, and it will.
Are you going to stand firm and follow the teachings of God, or are you going to fold to the world? That would be my only question. And if you find yourself not choosing the way of God, and folding, so to speak, um, you will regret it. You just have to endure and just believe and just know that, that, that, like, Jesus will never [00:43:00] leave you nor forsake you.
You have to really truly believe that. You cannot go wrong with Christ.
BOB: Do you think if you posted that meme today, that there would be the same reaction? Do you, like, the theme of our conference is a cultural tipping point, like we’re starting to figure out actually a woman is an adult human female.
We’re starting to realize that drag queens performing in front of kids isn’t right. We’re starting to see the consequences of confusing gender in marriage and other things. So, do you think by posting a Bible verse these days that there would still be the same fallout?
IZZY: I think the reaction would be different.
Um, as I, as I said earlier, I think now that, you know, even non -believers, people that don’t even believe that God exists, are now sick of, of the, the wokeness of, of things, you know, and, and, and they just, they can see how wrong that is, you know, so I think the reaction will be a lot different.
MARIA: Yeah, like what Izzy said, I think people were just sick of being [00:44:00] forced, um, Cos, I mean, in schools, like, parents, some parents, parents don’t have the right to, um, say yes or no to what their children are being taught at school. I just don’t like being told what to do. I don’t, I, I, I don’t, and I don’t believe in that as well.
Because everyone has a right to believe in what they believe in. I think one of the things is like, role models. Like a lot of the, we got thrown that a lot was, oh you’re a role model, you should know better, you should do better. But for starters, like all athletes say this, is like, I never asked to be a role model, like I’m just a netball player, or I’m just a rugby player, or what not.
A role model is, for me, is someone that um, believes in what they believe in and aren’t swayed any other way. I get so annoyed, you know, when you hear like, Oh, Izzy should have been a better role model. Well, he’s the greatest role model because he didn’t waver. He lost his whole contract, all sponsors, [00:45:00] every, like, everything we lost.
You know, literally 99 percent of well who we thought were our friends, that that is a role model to me and that’s what I want my children to model is, is, is you believe in Christ, you pay the price and you show love and you stand firm on it and you smile. For me, that is a role model, not someone who’s just does or goes by what the world says and the trends and follow that.
BOB: Which is kind of the irony, actually, because. The unit which was in charge of all of this is called the Integrity Unit. And yet to me, you guys showed more integrity than anybody because you stayed true to your values and your core beliefs. It’s kind of ironic, isn’t it?
IZZY: It is, it is. We want to live a life of integrity and God’s always watching.
At least at night we can sleep well, we’ve got peace in our hearts and that’s all that I care about is approval of God. And not just not conforming to the world or what [00:46:00] people think, you know. I understand the pressures that come from the society and the culture for, particularly for the younger generation.
Nothing’s too hard for God to, to do or to open and to do certain things. Um, if you truly believe that, God’s the God of impossible and that’s the God that we serve, you know.
BOB: Anything you want to say that we haven’t discussed?
MARIA: Like, thank you, really, for doing this. Yeah, thanks for, for standing. We watch you.
IZZY: Yeah, we do.
MARIA: I’m so emotional today. Oh my gosh.
IZZY: we actually do. We applaud you for the work that you’re doing within the political realm and everything and just making known that. You know the things that we talk about here, you know, is just bringing awareness that, you know, there is this truth, you know, and there’s a structure and how God things, uh, God created things and family structure and relationship between a man and woman.
Those things are important, [00:47:00] and as you said, I think you’ll just, you’re being a light over there in New Zealand and people that, uh, watch and they come across your channel and the things that you guys are doing on your platforms.
MARIA: We wish we were there with you guys. And to all the donors as well that donated.
I mean, I don’t know whether they’ll be at your forum, but, um…
BOB: Some will be.
IZZY: Yeah, yeah. Thank you so much. Thank you.
MARIA: Like, you, you, you’re always in our prayers. I would love to meet them in person, just to personally say thank you. Because they didn’t need to, and they did in such a, yeah, a really tough time in our, um.
I say, you know, it’s funny how you say, would you go through it again? And I look like I’m not with all the times that I’m crying. But I would, I would go through it again. Anyways. Thank you.
IZZY: Stand strong. You know that you got other brothers and sisters around the world that are, that are with you and supporting you.
And, um, yeah, it’s, um, we’re already, we’re winners already, you know, with, with Christ. So we’ve already won the battle. So that’s the, that’s the most important [00:48:00] thing.
